Ep. 309: How This International Real Estate Investor Creates Income From Anywhere with Sarah Hartstein
In this episode, I speak with Sarah Hartstein who is a Realtor, International Investor and Consultant. She helps her clients achieve the dream of owning and managing property abroad. She is here today to share her story of how she got started investing abroad and why she thinks it’s the next big trend.
Listen on to find out how this international real estate investor is able to create income from anywhere in the world.
Listen Below:
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Transcription:
Debbie:
Hey everyone, thank you so much for being here!
I am really excited to speak with my guest today. I’m here with Sarah.
Hi Sarah, how are you?
Sarah:
Hi, Debbie. I’m doing really well. How are you?
Debbie:
I’m wonderful. Thank you so much for joining us today. Can you tell us about you and why you live an offbeat life?
Sarah:
So, I would say that I’ve definitely lived several different offbeat lives in my lifetime but I’ll give you a little bit of a background. Before I get going into that, just so you know where I started from, I graduated from UCSB with a business economics and accounting degree and I started working for a CPA and I definitely thought that I was going to be a partner in a firm. One day I was studying for my CPA exams and one day when I had, you know, I had a job where I had a micro manager and it was just awful working there and you’re talking to your coworkers about where you’re going to travel and I hate this job and I want to quit the job. And, ended up actually quitting the job and doing a one week – I had one week planned to do a yacht week in Croatia and from there I ended up traveling for 11 months.
So, I knew then that my little dream of becoming a CPA was just, I did not have that dream anymore. So I ended up trying to come back home so I could make some money because while I was doing this solo trip travel of 11 months, I didn’t have a job at the time. I was working at hostels for a free bed to stay in, which is a whole different story. But, so when I got back I ended up, actually I had to get another accounting job to kind of, you know, make some money again. So once I did that, I was working there for about a year and I ended up asking my boss if I could work remotely after I had met my partner in Costa Rica. And we ended up traveling together, working remotely at my job that I was at.
And it was just amazing. Like that was the dream and that was everything that I had envisioned of traveling and working remotely and I was working like any kind of hours that I really wanted. As long as I got the job done, everything was fine. And then, you know, we were going to put, we were living in Bali and we were living in a van in New Zealand and we were doing all these things and then unfortunately the pandemic hit. So we had to fly home and we were living in Santa Barbara, California for a little while in a super tiny studio. And then we ended up getting pregnant, so we, yeah, so we were starting a family then all of a sudden and we were still living in California and I was still doing my other job, my – you know, corporate type job in accounting, so, what happened was my partner was not allowed to stay in the US for longer than 90 days cause he’s actually English. So he was from the UK.
Debbie:
Oh, okay.
Sarah:
And so once we got to California, they shut all the flights down and we, he couldn’t go anywhere. No one could go anywhere. And it was this kind of countdown game of is he going to have to stay past his 90 days? Like what is going on here? And the flights ended up opening like two, like we had booked flights because he had to leave at a certain time but all of the flights did open up again just a few days before our flights. And I ended up flying with him over to England so we could share our exciting news with his family and ended up traveling or kind of staying in England.
And we still wanted to travel a little bit while we were pregnant cause that was kind of the only way we could stay together really, until he came back to be with us for the childbirth. So, there weren’t very many places open at the time. We ended up going to Croatia because it was one of the only places open for Americans to go to and we did not plan anything really to be going on besides just going to Croatia. But within eight days we actually had an offer in on a property and I have never purchased a property before so this was my very first purchase – real estate purchase and that’s quite spontaneous even for me. I have a really spontaneous background in pretty much everything that I’ve done, but that, even that was a little bit wild for me. But I think my maternal instincts were kind of kicking in like I needed.
I was like nesting, I just wanted a home, I just wanted something. Me and my partner had always kind of talked about owning a little apartment or studio in several different places in Europe so we could travel for free and just move around and we’d always have a little place and we could rent them out on the side. And so that is kind of where I would say my now offbeat life has started with this purchase in Croatia. We purchased it in 2020 and I kind of kept it on the down low from my friends and family for a really long time because it was quite, I’ve never heard of anyone really doing this. And after about a year, I mean we were renting it out very successfully through the pandemic we were, we just loved it. We loved coming back and visiting it.
We just loved and I’m someone that doesn’t really like to go to the same, you know, destination twice. I just love to travel the world. So why would you go to the same place twice, you know? I just wanna see everything. But after having this experience of having a property somewhere and coming back and getting to know the location even better and even more, it was just so fun for me. And that kind of opened up a whole different perspective for me while we were pregnant. We actually fell pregnant twice in the last two and a half years. So, during my second pregnancy I was on maternity leave and I was talking to my friends on Instagram about this property that we had purchased and I started to notice a lot of questions and a lot of interest and I just kept talking about it and this is kind of where my consulting business began. So, now I’m kind of, I’m helping other Americans to get the confidence, I guess, with a trusted handhold from someone who’s done it to purchase property abroad as well kind of start a whole new lifestyle that I am so passionate about and just, I just love to share. I just love the idea of sharing that with anyone and everyone. So that is kind of where I’m at in my offbeat life at the moment.
Debbie:
Yeah, I mean that’s amazing how you had all of these uncertainties throughout your whole journey and you know, you had your regular corporate job you turned into a remote job and now you own like, you know, a place in Europe and I know like there was a lot of things that happened during that time. There was a lot of uncertainties. What made you decide to settle down in Croatia instead of maybe England or other parts of Europe? Because there’s so many choices out there, right?
Sarah:
I know there are so many choices and as we’re kind of looking for the next one, it’s such, it’s like really difficult to pick but that, so how did we choose Croatia? Basically, it just started because it was the only place for us to be able to visit and when we were here, we just loved it. And like I said, my other journey traveling abroad on my own started in Croatia too. So, I knew that I already had a love for this place. We were looking at property online and we could see that property was just much cheaper than where I’m, back where I’m from, back in California and so we were about to take, cause we were also looking for property in California before we left, but we were about to put down a down payment for the same amount that we purchased this entire apartment for.
Debbie:
Oh, wow.
Sarah:
So instead of having to get an $8,000 loan, yeah I had to, we just, we totally bypassed that. And the fun thing about Croatia is they don’t have property taxes over here so you pay your tax when you first buy your property. And then as we noticed, like we didn’t even realize that they didn’t have property taxes and our, we were kind of trying to do the numbers and we were saying, you know, if no one rented it from us the entire year we would probably, we would be spending about $1,400 on, you know, expenses. And we just looked at each other and thought yeah, that’s like kind of a no-brainer.
Debbie:
Like, yeah that made, that makes a lot more sense,
Sarah:
Yeah.
Debbie:
than like staying in a state where it’s so expensive and you know, a lot of places in the United States is just so expensive compared to certain areas in Europe for sure and you have a lot more beautiful scenery and you know, nature is just incredible over there.
Sarah:
Absolutely and you’re not really buying a property over here. I mean you are but you’re buying the lifestyle of being able to travel over here whenever you want.
Debbie:
Yeah.
Sarah:
I know some people only travel every so often because maybe obviously it’s expensive and especially since the pandemic everyone can work remotely now. Well a lot of people can and we noticed the price of AirBnB just skyrocketing.
Debbie:
Yeah.
Sarah:
And it’s just been really difficult for even us to be able to travel around still. And even though we have little certain ways that we can, you know, ask AirBnB hosts like, “Hey, can we get a discount if we stay for even longer?”, like that’s kind of not even a question anymore cause everyone wants to stay longer.
Debbie:
Yeah, yeah. There’s a lot more people doing this than before. So, now you have competition on where to stay.
Sarah:
I know!
Debbie:
Just finding the right place of where to stay at. So, now for yourself, I know that when you started this journey you were starting a family, how is that like for you to be able to do this in terms of, you know, is it harder for you? How are you able to create this dynamic where you can still make this type of lifestyle sustainable even when you are starting this new family that you have?
Sarah:
I think it’s just anything is possible if you put your mind to it. It is definitely difficult traveling with two girls that are two and a half and almost one year old. Every time we get on the plane, I – especially going across, cause we’ve gone back and forth with both of them, with one of them at least four times now. And every time I get off I say, “I cannot go anywhere,”, until I forget how that, like I have to forget about it before I book another flight because it is difficult. But it’s just something that’s always been a part of my life so I can’t really imagine not doing it with them. And I’m just really excited to include them in on that and I just really think it’s going to add a lot to their characters as they grow.
Debbie:
Yeah and it’s so different when you’re just living in one place and then you’re taking them to different locations and they can see different cultures. I think that’s so interesting to grow up in that type of environment rather than just in one place and also it’s great for you too because you don’t feel like you’re being tied down if you have that type of nature.
Sarah:
Definitely. I’ve always kind of been the looking for the next thing and it’s always been kind of hard for me to settle in one place. I think I’m kind of finally at the point where I’m looking to settle down into a home, not necessarily to live in all the time. I definitely still want to be able to have that AirBnB or vacation rental aspect to the home. But I wanna be able to rent out our home while we can still travel as well until the girls are a little bit older and need to be in school, we need a little more stability, of course.
Debbie:
Yeah, absolutely. So for you and your partner, Sarah, are you able to do the real estate investment in helping people in consulting? Is that your full-time gig or are you still doing your CPA job and then balancing this so that you can make this sustainable for yourselves?
Sarah:
Well I was balancing both for a little while and it was the most difficult thing I have ever done and it was not good for my mental health. So yeah, I ended up getting let go from my, you know, more corporate type job and I wasn’t quite ready for that move yet as I was still building Breeza Consulting, but you know, would I ever have been ready? I don’t know, you know, so now it’s just definitely given me that push I’ve always thought, I’ve always said everything happens for a reason and I know that I’m in the right place at the right time right now.
Debbie:
Yeah. I feel like there’s certain moments in our lives where we feel like we’re not ready and life just moves us in a totally new direction or into the direction that we should be going to. So, sometimes it’s like you’re the one that is going for it and then sometimes you get pushed into it.
Sarah:
Absolutely, just have to kind of go with the flow and just realize like this, there is something coming out of this later. I don’t know, it could be in one year or in 10 years, but something is happening for you in that moment and it’s just kind of in turmoil or whatever it’s in and just just wait it out and something good will come.
Debbie:
Yeah, absolutely, because it’s, I don’t know, I feel like you have to kind of live sometimes like when you have this type of mentality of living in a few different lives. So, you had your corporate CPA and then life and then you had your traveling all over with your husband life and now you have a family and now you’re doing real estate in different countries, so already like a few lives you’ve already lived, you know?
Sarah:
Definitely, I always like to say, cause I – when I was traveling on my own, I was living on such a budget that I would, you know, I would live in the cheapest hostel that I could find. I would look for the safest one, like near the rail, you know, near the train station or near an airport, but I would stay in a hostel with like 20 people in a room versus eight people in a room just to save like $2 a night, you know, I was like living on a budget of 50 to $70 a day. I wasn’t working at the time, like I said, I would live and work in hostels that were only like $15 a night. But I would try and work in the hostel, like helping with their laundry and cleaning the floors and the bathrooms. It was honestly horrible, but for a free place to stay so that I could continue traveling because I just absolutely loved it. I just knew it was for me, right away. And then working and meeting my boyfriend and traveling with him, we did the AirBnB traveling and that was like a nice step up. And I definitely look forward to and maybe a few years from now just adding in luxury travel onto my whole list of how it’s working, because we’re ready for that.
Debbie:
Yeah, it goes into stages, right? That’s how we always go, like in your twenties you’re just like, “Oh my gosh, I don’t care what I have to do, I just need to go out there and travel.”. That’s how I was, that’s how my boyfriend and I was. We would just like backpack through wherever and then you’d stay in like really bad areas and hotels just to get to those places. So, I definitely get you in that one, but yeah, as you grow older you’re like, “I need more luxury. I can’t keep doing this anymore.”.
Sarah:
Yeah, I’m really looking forward to that stage of life. I’m still kind of in that AirBnB, like still trying to stay on budget, but yeah, I can see it coming. Yeah.
Debbie:
Be like, yes, hopefully, hopefully soon, sooner rather than later. But let’s go back to that time when you actually, you had one week that you had planned to go to Europe and then it ended up being 11 months. How did that happen? Because that’s a huge step from like, “Hey, let’s go for a one week vacation.”, to like almost a full year of being in a new country and just traveling around.
Sarah:
I know, I just love that I even had to get my passport renewed the very day before I left for my flight because I think I only had like eight months left on my passport and I just didn’t know what was going to happen. So I set myself up for success basically to be able to do whatever came my way. And once I was on this yacht week, I was meeting people right away. It was just so much fun. I can’t recommend that enough for a young person to start their traveling journey with. But while I was on that boat, a lot of the people that were on there with us were from England and they were all kind of in the same group. And after they said, “Have you ever done, what is it called, a secret brunch?”, and I kind of got invited to England on this to go on this secret brunch with them.
And then from there I just thought, “Okay, well I’m now I’m in London, like I’m just going to keep traveling.”, so, I just kind of kept traveling from there and I just didn’t stop. I don’t know, it was, it just like never ended until I was, it was like five or six months in. And then I remember I used to work at this kid’s camp in Malibu for like 13 years. And so I remember someone from there moved from Malibu to this island called Saipan and they had a diff-, a couple other counselors had worked there. I don’t know how this like, I remembered about this, but I reached out and I said, “Hey, what’s up with this like working at PIC, basically is what the hotel is called, what’s going on with that?”, and so I applied for this job and I got this job where they moved me over to Saipan and I lived on like campus I would call it, with several other Americans.
And it was a six month contract, contracted thing and I was doing the wildest things that I can’t even imagine. Like, it was mostly like a lot of lifeguarding, but I would also, like I ended up in a mascot suit every once in a while, I had to like be a mascot. That was the probably the worst thing about it. I just like, I don’t know, you have to dance around. It was so embarrassing, but obviously no one knew it was you. You had to kind of like walk around the resort and like try and get people to do your water aerobics class or you’re like sitting in the lazy river and you’re like splashing the guests as they’re going around and just kind of having fun. And honestly that was such a fun job. I just, that’s kind of how that all went. And then after that was done, they offered to fly us home for free. So, I kind of took that opportunity to go home thinking that I would go right back out and travel again. But it is difficult to just go back out and travel once you’re home. There’s something about being home and having to plan or not having like someone to do it with you or I don’t know. So, that’s when I started working my more corporate job I would say in accounting.
Debbie:
Yeah, I mean that’s a lot of different things for you to do. I feel like there’s so many things that just came your way and then you just took advantage of it and it led you to where you’re supposed to be, which is now it’s so interesting, right? You don’t know where those little decisions that you make will take you because maybe if you didn’t go in certain places, you wouldn’t have met your partner and you wouldn’t have a family right now. Like what that would’ve taken you if you didn’t leave that job and go to Croatia and Europe, like, it’s like the world and the universe works in so many mysterious ways.
Sarah:
I totally agree and I just think if I could give advice to anyone considering traveling or that they already are traveling, it’s just have an open mind and don’t be afraid to say ‘yes’ to anything. But obviously, you know, keep your wits about you. But gosh, if you are going to, you just gotta be able to say yes because there are so many things on the other side of that Yes that you will, that will follow. And it is just such cool experience because like you were saying, like every single thing kind of led me to where I am and it is, it is really cool. It’s really cool to be, yeah.
Debbie:
And there seems to be opportunities as long as you try to find them. In terms of you doing this for 11 months, Sarah, how were you able to create some income? I know you said you would work in the hostels that you were staying in. How did you find like little jobs that you found? Did you look for them? Were they offered to you? How were you able to do this so that you could actually keep traveling?
Sarah:
I would look for these little jobs and also I wouldn’t look for them all the time. I was just kind of spending my savings. I had saved up quite a bit before I left maybe like at the time to me, it was a lot. It was like 10 grand I saved up and I just wanted to experience life. I was sick of sitting behind the desk of the nine to five and I hadn’t even been doing it that long. But I knew when I was doing that, that just wasn’t for me. And so I created this lifestyle for myself to be able to, I don’t know, just like literally live my best life because I always, I hate the saying of like, everyone’s working for the weekend. Like that is just not the, I don’t think I’m ever, ever gonna be someone who works for the weekend.
I, and even when we, me and my partner were traveling, say in New Zealand, we bought a van and we – to make money and you know, we weren’t even trying to make money then we had our jobs, but I put that van on websites for people to rent it out and when someone would come and rent out the van, we also had ourselves on another website called Trusted House sitters. So we would like house-sit people’s, you know, pets their houses and their pets and we would live there for like a month and kind of get to see what it was like living like a local in their, in their own home. And while we were doing that, we would rent out our van for money. And so it was just like genius to us to like, when we didn’t need the van, someone was using it and when we wanted to like settle down and play with a dog for a month like that was there too and it was all completely free.
Debbie:
Yeah, that is such a great idea because you’re still creating income from it and if you need more stability you get that too. That’s, I love that. That’s such a great idea.
Sarah:
Yeah, there’s a lot of ways to make money and to travel for free. Like they have that, it’s called hoofing, where you kind of like work on farms, you know, they give you a place to stay and they feed you for free and then you try to help with their, I don’t know, you might pick strawberries or you might do something with them during the week for a few hours a day and you get to know the local family. There’s other travelers doing it as well and it’s just a really fun way for young people who don’t have the means to just travel wherever they want to actually travel for free.
Debbie:
Yeah. And it seems like there’s just a lot of opportunities as long as you look for them. So for you Sarah, what has been the most interesting ways that you are able to create income while you were on the road?
Sarah:
I would say it was when we were in New Zealand, definitely renting at our van and living in other people’s houses. That is one of my favorite ways that I think you could make some money, even if it’s not as such a fancy van. It could be any type of camper car you could do that with anything. There’s always someone looking for something with a different budget.
Debbie:
Yeah, absolutely. And in those areas too, people are always trying to go on the road and see the country see different areas in that way. So that’s such a great idea. So what did you end up doing with that van once you guys left? You sold it obviously. Was it hard?
Sarah:
It was, yes. It was so sad. I was seriously, my baby, we looked so hard for it and it was just absolutely perfect. We bought it from a French couple and when we first got it, it started raining for about a week. So it was definitely a test of the relationship. So we were in this van for a week in the rain, but the sense of freedom, like the second we got into that van and started driving, I don’t know if it’s – that’s just something that like I personally really love, but it was incredible. We could just go anywhere and there’s – and in New Zealand you don’t really have to have a permit to like stay certain places. You can kind of just park on the side of the road or there’s certain places that you do have to park up in like certain areas, but you can kind of just like go off grid and do your thing and it is so, so freeing. I can’t recommend it more if you like driving and seeing beautiful scenery.
Debbie:
That is amazing. And how long were you in New Zealand for?
Sarah:
We were there for only 90 days. So we were originally supposed to be there for a year and I had sublet my apartment in Santa Barbara for like six months or yeah, I was like a short-term sublet. I wasn’t really sure what I was doing, again, it’s just like, like just all randomly spontaneous, whatever we can get our hands on. But we got someone to sublet our place and he was even paying more than I was paying, so I was actually making money from him renting the apartment and once he was in there for a little while, he actually reached out to me and said,, “Hey, I love this place. I can, I rent it for a year.”, so we ended up, you know, being able, I was, “Yes, of course, go ahead. Like we love this.”, so we ended up renting it for a year.
And what’s kind of interesting is around the time right before the pandemic hit, before like we knew anything of that, he asked to have a reduction in the rent and I said, “No, this is, you know, the rent, sorry.”, and then he decided to evacuate the premises, which at the time was like such a big deal. I had no idea what I was going to do. Obviously, I had to go home like, or would I not go home? Would I hire someone of my friends to just sell all of my stuff and I would, you know, get rid of my deposit or I wasn’t really sure what to do, but we decided to do the responsible thing and come home and handle it. But within that, the pandemic hit and the, the flights all closed. It’s like everything just happened in such perfect timing that once we were there, we, you know, were able to live in our apartment. If we would’ve actually stayed in New Zealand, we would’ve been, I think we would’ve been stuck in New Zealand cause that was one country that they like shut down borders for a really long time. They didn’t let anyone in or out. So I don’t know what would’ve happened if we would’ve stayed. It’s like fun to think about, but yeah.
Debbie:
Yeah. And you know, it’s like, um, things are meant to be and that’s what was supposed to happen. Like it sucks at that moment and you just don’t realize that that’s what’s supposed to happen.
Sarah:
Isn’t that funny? Yeah. So every time something like sucky happens, I just kind of try and remember that, that there’s a reason that that’s happening and it’s okay and just to like let it process and however long it takes for that to process something is happening and something is changing and the universe is always working in your favor as long as you are positive and you know that you don’t even have to be positive sometimes you don’t know what is going on and you could just be so hurt and so upset and then, you know, months or years, whatever down the road you’re like, “Hmm, if this wouldn’t have happened, yeah, this wouldn’t have happened.”.
Debbie:
Absolutely. I really, truly believe that, especially now with the world with the way it is. I’m like, “You just don’t know what’s supposed to be meant for you.”, maybe that was not, you know, obviously it wasn’t meant for you, it was meant for somebody else, maybe somebody needed it more than you, you know, maybe you are led to a certain lane in your life because that’s where you’re supposed to be. And I think just listening to that and it can get really depressing. You could get very upset when things just don’t, you know, pan out. But if you just believe that things will happen and you keep working towards it, it’s going to work out. You know, as long as you don’t give give up, that’s the main thing. Just don’t give up.
Sarah:
Yep, I agree.
Debbie:
I love that. So you’ve gone through so many journeys, Sarah, and now you have a family, right? So let’s move forward to maybe 30, 40 even 50 years from now and you’re looking back at your life. What legacy would you like to leave and what do you wanna be remembered for?
Sarah:
That is a really good question. I’m really hoping, and I know actually that this company that I’m starting is a new revolutionary idea that’s gonna be going on in the next 10 years. That people are gonna realize that buying property in America is expensive. And there are so many perks to buying abroad that I would love to leave behind just knowing that I’ve helped other, as many as one person buy a lifestyle abroad that they absolutely love and that they can pass down to future generations or they can retire on or they can just travel on or you know what, however that works out for them. I just, I just wanna see more people as happy as I am with the decisions that I’ve made that are quite risky if you can consider it like that cause it is a risk to buy in a country that you don’t know, you know, the language or you don’t know the laws, but if you have the right team behind you, you can have the resources and the support to make it fully capable possible.
Debbie:
Yeah, absolutely. And that’s the thing, so many things that you’ve done were kind of just like spur of the moment too, and you’re very – you’re a risk taker for sure, Sarah, you know, and I love that. I love when people are willing to take a risk on themselves and what they’re doing and not afraid to fail because I think that’s what most people are afraid of failing and falling in their faces, you know? And I love that you’re just like that, “That’ll happen. It’ll happen and if it doesn’t, it’s wonderful.”.
Sarah:
Yep, exactly. No risk, no reward, I guess. Right?
Debbie:
Absolutely.
Sarah:
It definitely also helped doing this with my partner, him being from the UK and being in the EU at some point it was kind of like if – would I have bought this property all on my own? I’m going to say no. I definitely wouldn’t have, I wouldn’t have wanted to. And I know a lot of people that want to, but it’s just, you need that, like that accountability or that push or that urge to just tell you it’s going to be okay. And there’s things that, you know, might go wrong because things can go wrong if you buy a property in America. But you know, it’s – there’s the same sort of things that could go wrong here. It’s just a little bit further away, which is, which can be daunting for some people. Or maybe the reason why they’d say like, “Well how do I manage it? How do I do anything basically if I’m all the way over here.”, but I would ask you the same question, question, if you are living in Florida and you owned a property in California, you know, it’s still far away. It’s still all the same. You still have to have your team over there to help you.
Debbie:
Absolutely. Yeah. We, we have a property in New York and we have to deal with that. We’re like, we’re down here, what do we do?
Sarah:
Yeah.
Debbie:
Like for, you know, so it’s, there’s always gonna be things that you have to think about. So yeah, there’s always things.
Sarah:
No matter where you are, there’s things -it doesn’t matter. So, just like enjoy a bit and maybe let’s get a vacation home and in Croatia or something. I don’t know.
Debbie:
Yeah, I love that. And of course if you’re interested in listening to Sarah’s tips of how to actually start doing this, how to purchase a property abroad, we’re going to be talking about this in our extended interview, so make sure you look out for that. Thank you so much, Sarah, for doing this with me today. If our listeners want to learn more about you, where can they find you?
Sarah:
They can find me on Instagram or on TikTok. I’m on TikTok these days, but yeah, probably Instagram is a good way to get ahold of me.
Debbie:
Thanks again, Sarah. We really appreciate you for being here and for sharing with us your journey with us.
Sarah:
No problem. It was really fun to be here. Thanks for having me.
Listen to Sarah’s extended interview where she talks about how to purchase real estate property abroad.
What you’ll find:
In this extended interview, Sarah talks to us about buying real estate property abroad.
