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Ep. 251: How this story teller uses personal connections to land dream clients with Joey Held

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In this episode, I speak with Joey Held who is a writer, podcaster, and author based in Austin, TX.

He is the founder of the Crisp Bounce Pass newsletter; host of the podcast Good People, Cool Things; and an author. 

Listen on to find out how this storyteller uses personal networking to land dream projects.

Listen Below:

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Transcription:

Debbie:

Hey everyone. Thank you so much for being here. I am really excited to be with my guest today. I’m here with Joey. 

Hey Joey, how are you?  

Joey:

Hi, Debbie. I’m doing great. We’re microphone twins. 

Debbie:

I know.

So Joey is also a podcaster and he’s like, “What kind of mic? Do we have the same mike?” I’m like, “I have to check.” I’m so bad with tech, I’m like, “Yeah. I think we do, Joey.” 

Joey:

Very snazzy.

Debbie:

Exactly. 

But thank you for being here, Joey. I really appreciate it. 

Can you tell us about you and why you live an offbeat life?

Joey:

Yeah.

So, I actually think I’m probably a little different than most of your guests because I do have a nine-to-five. I work for a company called INK Communications, and we do full-service communications for companies from social, PR, design, content, all that good stuff. 

But outside of that, I have many projects that have taken me really all over the country and world to pull them off. I am an author, I’m a freelance writer, I have a Vespa and pop culture newsletter, and a food blogger. 

And people often ask, “How do you get enough sleep?” And the answer is sometimes I don’t but sometimes you sleep for the full experience. 

But I’ve always been interested in traveling. And I think over the past couple of years, obviously the pandemic has somehow both limited travel and opened it up a little bit and that you could work really from anywhere and it still works out nicely. 

And so I’ve definitely taken advantage of that. Certainly not as much last year, it’s this year when I really couldn’t move, unless you wanted a road trip everywhere while living in Austin, just getting out of Texas is several hours. To see other states was quite the endeavor. 

But I spend a lot of fun and looking forward to more adventures coming up. 

Debbie:

Yeah.

Well, that’s a lot, right? And Joey’s the type of person that he’s just, like, on the go, you like to do different things that seem like. And you talked about your nine-to-five and that’s the thing. I always say to people, there’s nothing wrong with a nine-to-five. If you enjoy it, if it gives you what you need in your life, there’s nothing wrong with that, right? 

As long as you still have the freedom to do what you want to do. And that’s exactly what you’re doing. You have a lot of things that you like to do in your spare time. And also I feel like you’ve lived so many different lives. 

Joey:

Yeah. 

I credit my parents for it. They took me traveling from a really young age. I don’t believe this was the first trip that I went on but I remember back-to-back summers just before I turned eight and nine, we went to Hawaii and Alaska. And I still remember elements from those, like, we went swimming with dolphins in Hawaii. 

I apparently have, like, an hour-long conversation with a random woman about the Chicago Bulls. I grew up in Chicago so I’m a big Bulls fan. And we talked about Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen, all the greatness. We probably just covered the Last Dance that came out last year but 22 years before.

But that just started kind of the travel bug and I think that is just such a great way both to see new sights and have new experiences but weirdly to learn what the rest of the world is like. Because every other place has a different culture than the place that you grew up in. 

And people are always, like, in other countries, they’re so welcoming. They’re like, “You’re from out of town, let me tell you my life story, and let me show you this great hole-in-the-wall place that you never find in a travel guide or anything like that.” And it’s always been such a great time. 

Even if it’s an 18-hour flight delay and I’ve been exhausted and carrying, like, six suitcases. I’m more of the subtle packer, I guess. Even when you’re at your worst, you just meet one person that’s just, like, so cheerful and happy and excited that you’re in their hometown and it washes away all the bad stuff.

Debbie:

Yeah. I completely agree with that. 

I mean, you definitely meet a lot of different types of people during your travels. And you mentioned this too, Joey, when you were in the same country, you’re still in the United States, and you are really proud of where you come from, in the state that you’re coming from. 

I’m from New York City and when I go to other states, they’re very curious about what it’s like in New York and then the same, like, if I meet somebody from, like, Wyoming, I’m like, “What is it like over there? Is it all horses? Do you have cowboys? Is it all prairies? What is it?” 

Joey:

What’s the stereotype that you get? 

Debbie:

I think it’s more about our accents, like, Brooklyn accents, Long Island accents, and all of that stuff. And it’s funny because there are certain words that I would say like “coffee”, they’re like “Coffee?”I can’t say it, I say “coffee”. I think that’s the one thing, They’re like, “Say coffee,” I’m like “Coffee”. But how do you say it regularly? I don’t know because that’s how I say it. 

Joey:

Sounds great.

Debbie:

It’s so interesting, right? You don’t even need to leave your own country to have a different type of culture. Like, even the foods are different from the south, from the west, from the east coast and it’s so interesting what you learn from each other. 

And you’re right. Like, when you have really long layovers, and I’ve had trips where we were actually put in a different country. Like, I was supposed to go to Greece and I ended up in Italy. 

And then, I met people who were on the same flight who were like, stunt people for, like, celebrities and I’m like, “How did…? Oh, it’s because I traveled. Now, I get to meet these interesting people out of nowhere, that I didn’t even plan to.” 

So that’s so interesting that you’re able to do this. Now, I know everything has changed and you mentioned this, Joey, especially within the last 2 years, everyone’s life has changed. What has it done to you? Because you do have this spirit of exploration and you like going on these different journeys. How have you managed to keep that going?

Joey:

It actually reconnected me with a lot of old friends and colleagues. And I know when the pandemic first started, I tried to kind of make it a point to reach out to at least a couple of people a week that I hadn’t talked to in a while. Just be like, “Hey, this sucks. We’re all going through the same thing. But, like, what’s new in your world?”

And in some cases it led to some freelance work down the line, I’ll be like, “Hey, I’m actually at this company now and we’re looking for writers. I know you’re a writer, let’s chat,” which is super cool. There’s definitely no ulterior motive behind it. 

I think it just goes back again to traveling as a kid. I think it introduced a kind of a curiosity about me, which I always have had but I think that gets opened up even more. And I would say I’m not, like, the most extroverted person in the world but I think it’s interesting to meet new people and to kind of cure their experiences and what they’ve been through.

And I think that has lent itself throughout my career obviously throughout the pandemic ’cause I’m like, “Hey, if I can’t travel International, like, I haven’t been out of the country since the pandemic started, which is sad but maybe in the coming year.” 

But it’s been a nice way to kind of connect with people and U was like, “Hey, maybe I can’t go to Argentina right now but I know a friend that’s in there and they can kind of a must-give.” So much like if you’re channel surfing and you see little, like, a five-minute clip. I don’t even know what the show would be called but just, like, “Traveling the world with Joey’s friends. Coming soon to all streaming platforms.”

But yeah, it’s been so much fun just to reconnect with people. And one of the things I neglected to mention on the laundry list of things that I do, I’m also in a band. 

And again, during the pandemic, concerts, live music, not so much a thing but that was a good opportunity to kind of, like, recharge, work on some different songs, different things that we have maybe kind of dabbled with a little bit. It’s like, “Okay, now we’ve got time to kind of hone in on these.” 

And we’ve had a few shows this year and going back to travel again but I think a concert is, like, one of the greatest mashups of people that you’ll ever see because everyone loves music. If someone ever says, “I’m not really into music,” I don’t, I have heard people say that but I don’t believe them. I’m like, “There’s got to be at least some songs that you like.” 

Debbie:

Yeah.

Joey:

You have people from all these different backgrounds coming together and they might never interact otherwise. Like, they would probably never cross paths but they have a shared interest in whoever the musician that they’re seeing is. 

And then you just see them, like, they’re dancing like nobody’s watching. Their arms around each other, like, swaying back and forth, they might pull out their lighters, it’s like a big bonding moment for everyone. 

And I remember seeing a show shortly after things kind of opened back up again, and the artist was talking and it was almost like a catharsis. Like, the weight was just off of everyone’s shoulders of being able to see this music and getting outside and just being like, “I’ve missed this.” It’s just like a collective sigh of relief and it was super cool. 

Debbie:

It’s kind of crazy how you don’t know what you miss until it’s gone, until it’s taken away from you which is so sad. And I think one of the things that we’ve all gotten from this pandemic is just having that appreciation for life because we don’t know how great we have it until we literally cannot leave our house. 

Like, I can’t see the people that we love and we can enjoy the simple things in life like music outdoors, concerts being in a crowd of people, just being with strangers, like, giving a handshake, giving a hug. I mean, those are basic human things that you can’t really do, at least for a really long time. 

So it’s kind of crazy how it’s been for the last few years. You can’t even do those really basic things unless you’re obviously living with that person and you’re with them 24/7. But it’s so interesting. 

But I do want to go back to what you were saying before, Joey, in terms of you, like, being able to start freelancing because you talk to different types of people. And one thing that I noticed about you, you’re just very easy to talk to and I think that’s one of the things. 

If you’re an easy person to talk to, people are more able to relate to you, you’re more relatable and that’s a really good way of networking. And I want to go back to that because that’s a form of networking but it’s super chill. 

You’re just having a conversation with someone and then you tap into the right questions and then all of a sudden they give you this tidbit and they’re like, “Oh, you mentioned you’re a writer and you’re a good one. Maybe we could hire you.” Did you even think about doing that or was it just by accident?

Joey:

I think that’s just kind of happened by accident. I always like to say that people want to help out people they like and if you can develop good relationships with people. I still remember way back in the day, I worked at a company that did social media management for small and medium businesses. 

And one of the sorts of elements of that was reaching out to people on Twitter that might be, for example, an auto shop was nearby, people that were like, “Uh! I just got a flat tire.” Like, “Hey, my car has been acting up,” to reach out to them to kind of be like, “Hey, we’re nearby.” 

But I still remember one of my co-workers at the time. He was trying to tell people, like, you got to start a conversation. You can’t just immediately go hard sell on that. He’s like, “You are free and someone walks up to you and was like, ‘Hi, buy this product right now.’” He’s like, “You’d run away from them in terror.” 

And he’s like, “It’s the same thing even in a digital sort of setting like that.” And I think even though I learned that, like, several years after I started freelancing, I think I kind of try to keep that in my head. 

And I would say probably 80% of the freelancing work that I’ve ever gotten has either been from networking with someone directly or someone that I have worked with recommending me to someone else and then it goes from there. 

And the most unusual one, for now, I’m sure more will pop up later, this is back, maybe, like, 2016, 2017. South by Southwest is a big thing here in Austin. Kind of just takes over several blocks of the city. 

And I remember just walking by a house that was playing music and I said, “That sounds fun. I’m going to go in. Let’s see.” The door was open, it was like, “Come on in.” And it was just an event. There was, like, jazz music and a little, like, classy breakfast buffet going on and I said, “Alright, I’m gonna have a bite to eat.” 

And I just happened to stop at a table that had an open space. I was all just standing at tables, started talking with the people there. One of them happened to work for a company that was like, “Oh, we just got a lot of funding and we need more content to write.” And we shot the ball a little bit and she was like, “Alright, let’s say let’s get each other’s contact information. We’ll talk.”

And then we got in touch. Maybe a week or so went by and she said, “We’re putting a pause on the content for now but, like, I still want to keep in touch with you.” And I was like, “Okay, sure. Sounds good.” Like, not thinking that’s probably the end of it but, like, “Always good to stay in touch.” 

And then it was probably about a year later she was like, “Alright, we’ve got a plan now. Everything’s in place. Are you still looking for work?” And I was like, “Heck, yeah, I am. Let’s do it.” And I still am working with that client.

People have moved into the raw but all of them have been lovely to work with. And it’s the same. I think it goes the other way too. Like, we obviously want work that’s good and enjoyable. I think part of that is working with good people. 

Like, there is some writing that I’ve done where I’m like, “This is probably not the most interesting topic but I get to learn new things and I am working with people that I like.” If the person is horrible to me, I’ll probably be like, “Hey, this has been the most interesting thing in the world that I’m writing about but you’re not a pleasant person to work with so…”

Debbie: 

But that’s true because even if the content, even if what it is that you’re doing, you really love and enjoy, if you’re working with people that you just can’t stand, it makes it really unbearable, right? And that goes with your boss or the client, or even you as a person. If you’re also unbearable to work with, nobody’s going to want to work with you. 

So it goes both ways but that’s so freaking funny, Joey. Oh my God, I can’t even imagine. I’m just like, “These people are awesome because it’s like some random person just crashes their party and then you get a job from it.” 

And I’m like, “We need to, like, hang out with Joey because he just probably gets into the most awesome things. Like, just random things and meet the most interesting people because you’re not afraid to put yourself out there. And I think the biggest thing is you are not afraid to take a risk. And you’re not afraid to look foolish, right? 

Joey:

Yes.

Debbie: 

Because you could have totally gone in there and then people would have been like, “What are you doing in my house?” You would have just been like, “I just loved your music.” And I feel like they would have been like, “You’re welcome in,” because of how you are. That is so funny. 

So, aside from that Joey, now, I’m really curious because you do these, like, offbeat, outlandish things, what has been the most interesting thing that you have done? Whether it’s, like, things, like this during your travels that we’re just, like, off the cuff that you’ve just done. 

Joey:

Yes, I don’t know if we have time for all of those.

Debbie: 

You’re like, “There’s too many.”

Joey:

I’ll give this one ‘cause this was probably more off-the-cuff. I’d like to say a lot of the travel, I’ve definitely gotten off-the-cuff travel things, so… Actually, you know what? No, this one.

So while I was in Austin, I got invited again. The perks of being a food blogger, you get invited, let’s get the hair flip, to all kinds of fun events. 

And I got invited to a company called The Distillery, which is based in the UK but they were launching a handful of gin lines within the US. And Texas was one of the states that they were doing. So they were like, “Come get to try out the gin. We’ll give you a history of a company, like, bites. All that good stuff.” 

And it was at a bar that was on the second floor above a nonbar. I still don’t know what the lower floor building was. So I walked by it, like, 8 times and I was like, “Well, this is what Google Maps says. Do I just go up the stairs?” And then I did and that was the correct answer. 

And the woman who was running everything from a PR standpoint. She was based in Australia but she was like, “Where in the UK. So if you ever find yourself in London,” and I was going there in a couple of months for vacation. And I said, “You know what? It’s funny you said that because I will be.” And she said, “Great. Hit me up in a couple of weeks beforehand. Will get you set up for the full tour at the Distillery.” 

And for my fellow gin drinkers that are listening, this is the best place for gin. Like, go, if you’re in London, go to The Distillery, they have the ginstitute where they teach you about gin all while they’re giving you these fancy gin cocktails. 

And then you go and make your own gin. You get to smell all the botanicals to be like, “Oh, asparagus. I’ll put a hank in there. Black peppercorn, let’s skip that ‘cause it’s all too spicy,” all that good stuff. 

And then they give you a bottle of their classic gin but then a bottle of the gin that you made to take out. And I said, “I made this. You can name it whatever you want but a little label on it and it’s very official. It’s wonderful.” 

They do not sell it afterward but it’s probably for the best because I think some people probably did some odd combinations of flavor but it was so much fun. And again, like, you meet people, like, I’m sitting next to someone from the Netherlands and then on the other side somewhere from France who is visiting on vacation. It’s just so cool to see people from all walks of life bonding over gin.

Debbie: 

That is hilarious. That is so funny, right? 

Like, you do this because you’re a food blogger, which is awesome. And then you go to London and then you create your own gin. Heyyyyyy.

Joey:

The natural progression.

Debbie:

Yeah.

Just going to a party to, like, going to a different country and creating a whole bottle of gin that you created yourself. I mean, come on guys. But that is amazing. I love that. I love how you’re showing us the power of networking, the power of just putting yourself out there. 

Now, Joey, for people, because obviously, you’re one of a kind, we’re not all like you, we can’t just go out there and, like, talk to random strangers and, like, get their life story and all this information from them and one meeting, ‘cause apparently, that’s what you do, sir. 

How would you kind of show somebody who’s maybe not as adventurous as you to make that sort of connection with other people whether online or in-person? I feel like online, it’s a little bit, I mean, that’s for me at least. That’s what I think. It’s maybe a bit easier online ’cause you’re not face-to-face. 

I feel like it’s more nerve-wracking when you’re conversing with somebody in person. But either way, how would you give somebody that advice of having a real connection, an organic connection that could lead to something? 

Joey:

Yeah.

I think it does differ a little bit: online versus in-person ‘cause they’re definitely been times in person where I’m just like, “Uh, there’s a group of, like, 18 people and they all seem to be best friends. I can’t approach that.” 

Debbie:

Yeah.

Joey:

And I think online, a way that I’ve done it is I comment on things. So whether it’s on, like, Instagram or even in a blog post or something that someone has done, I say, “That was really helpful. I really like this part.” And then asking a follow request. 

I think people obviously love talking about themselves so getting them to do that makes them feel good. And they’re like, “Oh, I like talking to this person.” And because a lot of what they’re saying is about themselves so they’re like, “That person makes me feel good because they’re kind of boosting their own self-ego on that.” 

And I say that not like a big egotistical thing. Like, you’re getting them to kind of open up and share some things about themselves. 

And I think in-person, it can be a similar type of thing. And if it’s at a networking event, I think you could acknowledge the awkwardness of things. 

I’m going to get a shout-out to one of my favorite television show’s impractical jokers on TruTV which no one gets but there are clips on YouTube and all the good stuff. But the general premise of the show is it’s four friends that have known each other for a long time and then they are put into situations where they have to say and do kind of, like, weird things.

And the other ones are telling them what to do, they’re interacting. And it’s really shown me that if you’re weird, like, most people don’t seem to care. Like, they’re based in New York and as you know, New York is just a mash-up of people from all different walks of life. 

And there is one scene where one of them is literally on his back. He is, like, falling off a chair. He’s outside with, like, his legs up in the air, he’s like a turtle that’s been, like, flipped over. And everyone’s just walking by it like, “Another day. Another Tuesday, that’s just a guy on his back.”

Debbie:

Joey, that’s true.

No, seriously.

We see, like, the weirdest things in New York. And I’m not kidding. Like, there are things in the subway, if you go there. I mean, what he’s doing is not even strange. 

Joey:

And that’s I think a good reminder of things. Like, we build up stuff in our head like, “Oh, this is so embarrassing. I tripped and everyone saw me.” And it’s like, “No, most people are not paying that close of attention to what’s going on around them.” 

And I think if you’re at a networking event, you can say, like, super awkward, isn’t it? Like, it’s tough to walk up to people and then kind of, like, get into the conversation that way. Like, you’re bonding over, “Hey, this is kind of awkward to talk with people in, like, a forth setting like this.”

And I think when you are kind of just vulnerable like that, it pays off so much more than if you’re trying to, like, you puff out your chest and you walk over and you’re like, “Hey..” Smoothly leaned up against the bar and dabble at people.

Debbie:

That is so funny. 

I think it’s, like, five years ago. I had this other business where I had to constantly network. I had to go to a lot of different events and that’s what it was. Like, in the beginning, it’s super, super awkward. It’s just so awkward ‘cause, you’re right, there are just certain people where there’s, like, five or 10 of them that just know each other. They just go to these events together and I’m like, “Why? Come on! 

And it’s so hard to get in there. It’s like a barricade. They’re all, like, in it together, and then oftentimes it just be like, “Oh, hey. How are you?” Try to get one person out of there. 

It’s just a matter of, again, putting yourself out there. Not being afraid to be uncomfortable. And it really reminds me when you talk about allowing people to talk about themselves ‘cause they love… We all do, right? 

I love to talk about myself, you love to talk about yourself ’cause we’re the most interesting thing that we could talk about because we know nothing else. And when you show that appreciation and genuine interest in them, it really shows and it makes you stand out too. 

And a book that is really, really good to read about this, and you probably read it too, Joey, is How to Win Friends and Influence People. 

Joey:

Yeah.

Debbie:

And exactly what it tells you to do is to have a genuine interest to ask questions and then it’s going to lead them. You don’t even need to be there to be like, “Hey, what about me?” They’re going to naturally be more, I guess, it’s like you’re more magnetic to them without even doing anything because you’re showing that interest for them. 

They’re like, “Oh my God, this person is so interesting.” Meanwhile, they don’t even know anything about you but you know everything about them. And it’s like, that’s what makes you interesting because you do have that genuine interest for them. 

And also another person that talks about being uncomfortable and doing something uncomfortable, at least, once a day, is Tim Ferriss. He says that all the time and he’s like, “Do one thing that’s uncomfortable every single day, and it leads to really amazing things. 

And I think I’ve seen that show that you’re talking about, by the way, where they have, like, the things in their ears. 

Joey:

Yes.

Debbie:

I’m like, “I think I know what you’re talking about.” I think I’m seeing, like, YouTube stuff on them too, like, little clips. I’m like, “That’s so hilarious.”

Joey:

Yeah.

I think that’s a good point too of having a genuine interest because I think people could generally tell if you’re faking it. 

Debbie:

Yeah. Absolutely.

Joey:

And you’re not gonna find everyone interesting. Not a hundred percent of people will have similar interests or even if they’re different interests, like, they just might not drive with you and that’s totally fine. But if you’re trying to fake your way through it, that’s probably not going to turn out very well. 

And of course, I have a question for you. What’s the uncomfortable thing you’ve done today?

Debbie:

Uncomfortable thing I’ve done today? I don’t know if it’s really uncomfortable but the last week, I’ve been pushing myself to, like, run further than I’ve run. That’s what I’ve been doing and it wasn’t uncomfortable to me but it was uncomfortable for my husband ’cause he hates running. 

So, there’s this one thing that I do, like, when I’m about to give up. Like, for example, with the running thing, like, if I’m trying to reach 30 minutes and I’ve been doing, like, 25 minutes and I’m like, “5 minutes, 5 more minutes.” And what I typically do is self-talk.

I’m like, “If you do 5 more minutes, you’re going to get 10,000 more page views on your blog because you’re going to work for it. You’re a hard worker. You are going to work for this. So if you don’t do that 5 minutes, you’re not going to get that ten thousand more page views on your website.” 

So then I just keep pushing harder and I’m, like, almost dead and I’m like, “2 more minutes otherwise I won’t get it.” So that’s what I do every time when I want to reach another goal, especially with, like, my fitness goal, especially with my business. 

And then I did that today with my husband and it works so well. I’m like, “If you do 5 more minutes, you’re going to reach this goal that you’ve been wanting because you’re a heartbreaker, you’re going to do it.” And he just kept pushing, I was like, “Yeah!” He’s like, “Oh my God, that works.” I’m like, “Yes.”

Joey:

The internal voice is powerful for sure. 

Debbie:

Yes.

He was like, “I totally needed that. It hurts like a bitch but that was…” 

So I don’t think it’s too uncomfortable but it’s like, it’s just uncomfortable for your body. Like, things that you normally can’t do if you don’t do that. Well, at least for me, like, that self-talk. Otherwise, I’ll just be like, “Well, I’m tired, I could just give up.” But then I’m like, “If I don’t do this then I can’t…”

So that’s I guess uncomfortable. What about you, Joey? Did you do anything uncomfortable this week? 

Joey:

I think mine might come later tonight. I’m having dinner with a client. I know one of them very well and then the other two I’m meeting for the first time. 

And I think that can always be an interesting dynamic because you’ve got your little inside jokes with the one, same thing with the networking pod of, like, eight people together. They’ll be like, “What does that mean?” And I’m like, “I don’t know what that is. Is that a real thing? Is it just there? I don’t know.”

And so I think that would be fine. I also try DIY discreetly but I was very obvious about it. I took a picture of a super small dog when I got coffee today and the owner certainly noticed but I kind of glanced like, “You know your dog’s really small, you’re going to get photos taken.”

Debbie:

“So this is your fault. This is not my fault.”

Joey:

Yeah. “That’ll teach you.”

Debbie:

I love that. 

So one thing is, like, you often do things that make you uncomfortable, right? Or at least you’re not shy from doing that. Do you sometimes feel, like, you’re comfortable with it now that it’s not as uncomfortable anymore, or do you kind of still get that, like, uncomfortable feeling before you do it? 

Joey:

It depends on what it is. I would even argue, like, playing that show can be uncomfortable. Even though I played guitar for many moons and it’s always a great time and we just kind of… I would like to say if I’m not as confident in a part, I just, like, dance around on stage and look like I know what I’m doing and then it works out. But, yeah, they’re still, like, the little butterflies that happen before the show.

I had a public speaking professor in college and she always said just like, “You physically shake out the bad feelings.” So if you are ever about to do something uncomfortable, she’s like, “You say ew and you shake out your arms, shake out your legs.” That was just for public speaking but I’ve done that in other situations.

I’m going into, I guess, it’s still kind of public speaking, like, a pitch meeting but something like that where I’m like, “Okay. This isn’t a hundred percent comfortable. I’m still, like, a little shaky on some stuff but let’s get rid of the bad thoughts, go in there, and feel great.” And it really does work. 

The same professor would sometimes, like, sniff markers while she was writing something on the board. I don’t know if I agree with all of her teachings but there was some good wisdom in there. 

Debbie:

There’s a lot of weirdness in some gems.

Joey:

Yes. You gotta dig through the weirdness sometimes to find the gems but that’s part of the fun.

Debbie:

I love that. 

So, Joey, let’s fast forward two around 30 to 40 years from now and you’re looking back at your life, what legacy would you like to leave and what do you want to be remembered for?

Joey:

I think this is probably a little sappy but I just want people to think, “Oh, when I was with Joey that was a more fun time than when I wasn’t with him.” Whether it was just a 5-minute conversation or hanging out several times a week. Like, I want people to be like, “You know what? He made me feel better. I like that.” 

Debbie:

That’s a really good thing ’cause I think it’s something that may seem small but over time, like, it means something. And every time somebody meets you or even hears your name, they’ll always remember those moments and that is such a good legacy. Like, if they talk about you to other people, again, if they just hear your name, I think that’s a really cool legacy to have.

I think that’s awesome.

Joey:

Wanna smile not like a voodoo doll. I’m like, “I’m gonna stab a knee cap real quick.

Debbie:

I hope not. Oh, boy.

I don’t know. I believe in everything so I’m just like, “Oh, no, Joey. I hope not.” 

Joey:

We’ll check back in 30 or 40 years if I have a crippling knee pain or something. We’ll know why.

Debbie:

No, Joey, no. 

I love it. 

Well, thank you so much for being here with us. I had such a great time with you. See, you’re already getting into that legacy. 

If our listeners want to learn more about you, where can they find you?

Joey:

Well, I had a lovely time with you, as well, Debbie. So right back at you. 

You can find me on many different platforms but JoeyHeld.com is a nice sort of central base. Most of the shenanigans that we’ve talked about, you can get through there. And I’m on Twitter @josephcurrency so come and say hello. 

Debbie:

Love it. 

Yes, he does so many different things so make sure you guys check that out. And to make it easier for you, we also have it on our show notes on the website. 

So thank you again, Joey, for being here with us, we really appreciate you.

Joey:

Yeah. Thanks so much, Debbie.


Listen to Joey’s extended interview where he shares how to use the art of storytelling to promote your business.

What you’ll find:

In this episode, Joey will show you the proper way of utilizing the art of storytelling to effectively promote your business.


Follow Joey:


Show Credits:

Audio Engineer: Ben Smith

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