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Ep. 283: How This Website Consultant Became a Digital Nomad with Kayla Ihrig

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In this episode, I speak with Kayla who is a blogger, website traffic consultant, and remote work enthusiast. She blogs about the remote work lifestyle while living abroad and traveling. Kayla lives for conversations about increasing traffic, blogging better, and bucket lists.

Originally from the US but now living in the Netherlands, she’s used the opportunities online to build her dream life and encourages other curious souls to do the same.

Listen on to find out how this remote writer has been able to live anywhere in the world.


Listen Below:

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Ep. 282: How This Digital Nomad Inspires Solo Female Travel with Julie Be Trippin’
Ep. 281: MOJ: 5 Year Anniversary Episode: Expected and Unexpected Changes with Debbie and Aaron
Ep. 280: How This Entrepreneur Helps Others Fast Track to Freedom with Jodie Cook


Transcription:

Debbie:

Hey everyone!

Thank you so much for being here. I am so excited to speak with my guest today.

I’m here with Kayla. Hi Kayla!

Kayla:

Hi, Debbie! Thanks so much for having me.

Debbie:

Thank you so much for being here. Can you tell us more about you and why you live an offbeat life?

Kayla:

Yeah, so my name’s Kayla, I currently live in the Netherlands, but I’m originally from Pennsylvania, USA and I started on my path to an offbeat life in 2017.

I was living in Chicago, working in a job that I actually really liked and I loved living in Chicago. I just moved there and life was really good, but I just, I just couldn’t get the idea of travel and adventure in the fact that I was sitting in a, like in a cubicle for like 9, 10 hours a day in my twenties and feeling like “man, I thought life would kind of be more fun, be more like I thought there would be more than just working”.

And I discovered the digital nomad lifestyle on Instagram and fell in love. And I found remote work online and I quit my job and quit my apartment, put everything in storage and then went traveling.

I went backpacking through Central America and then South America. And then I ended up meeting my husband and I moved to the Netherlands and I’ve been living in Europe ever since.

Debbie:

Wow, that is a journey that most of our listeners would be like, “wow, I wanna do that, that sounds amazing!”.

And it’s so funny, I was smiling when you were saying that you saw the digital nomad lifestyle on Instagram because I think now a lot of people look to social media to find inspiration and that’s exactly what happened to you now, why did you take the risk to leave your job and to do this? Not knowing, you know, personally, I mean, did you know anyone who was a digital nomad outside of social media?

Kayla:

No and people acted like it was really weird back then. I’m not sure if people can even remember if you know, now remote work is so normal, 2020 blew it wide open and people started, you know, moving to cheaper places because their job was suddenly fully remote.

That became much more normal during the pandemic. But before that, people like actively discouraged it.

If you brought up being remote to a lot of jobs or employers, you were, you know, there was a negative reaction.

I didn’t try. I just decided to find a new job because I knew that that role, I knew that it would never transfer remotely. I just decided to try it anyway.

Despite lots of, you know, discouragement, honestly, a lot of people thought like it was so weird, you know, but now everybody knows it’s not that weird because we all follow someone online who does it. And we think of them as like our friend, you know, like, well, my friend Anna does this and we all have this like gusto to try it for ourselves, I think.

Debbie:

Yeah and I think it takes a lot of guts to do that. And not really know anyone in your circle who has been able to do it and do it successfully.

And you’re right, a few years ago, before the pandemic, remote work, being a freelance remote work or a digital nomad was kind of like, really in a way it was still taboo. Right?

Because people thought that it was unrealistic. It wasn’t sustainable. And I was in the same boat as you, Kayla.

Every time I told people it was what I was doing, they were like, “Yeah, good luck with that.”.

And then the pandemic happened and it was like, “Okay, how did you make this sustainable? Because I don’t wanna go back to my office. I don’t wanna do, you know, not like regular cubicle work anymore.”.

Kayla:

Yeah. Lots of people are circling back to remembering, “Oh, Anna, I used to work with her and she did this.”. And meanwhile, they’re forgetting, “I told her, I thought it was crazy”. You know, they’re remembering that you did it successfully.

Debbie:

So, when you were thinking about doing this, obviously you were inspired by other people, even though it wasn’t someone in your circle, you were still inspired to do it.

What made you decide to push yourself over the edge and go out of your comfort zone to do this? Because that is really tough. That is a huge decision that you had to make and you left a job, right?

And I’m sure there’s a lot of things that went over your head about like worst case scenarios because if you didn’t think it, I’m sure somebody said it.

Kayla:

Yeah, you said that, I wasn’t even thinking about my retirement fund. And then I remember getting coffee one day after the announcement had been made at work that I was leaving and this was what I was doing and I was getting coffee.

And this one, older man who worked there, came up to me, we had never spoken before, it was a big office.

And he said, “Well, you’re gonna regret that whenever your retirement fund’s empty”. And I was like, so surprised, but I looked at him and I said, and I knew him, he didn’t know me personally and I said, “Brian, I’m 23. I’ll be okay. You know? I have time.”.

And I think that it was really realizing that I am going to regret it so much if I just never try. I mean, when will it be easier? I mean, I had a lot going for me.

There’s a lot of privilege involved in walking away from a good job, but I didn’t have kids. I had a one year lease on my apartment. I lived in a studio. I didn’t have that much stuff. I was single. There was just it.

I felt like it will literally never be easier than it is now, even though it’s so scary. And I was terrified, like I bought my backpack and all my stuff, and I was so afraid and I literally, I put it all out.

I lived in this one room apartment and I put it out on the wall, like across from my bed. I cropped up my backpack that I bought and then I was looking at it and I was so scared to go traveling, but I put a post-it note above it that said, “Don’t be scared.”.

And then there were days whenever I was so scared and I thought maybe I can’t do it. Maybe I can’t leave. You know? Because I had decided to leave months before I actually quit my job.

So, I had all this room to like, you know, for bacskies, pretty much. And I actually moved my backpack in front of the sticker that said “don’t be scared”, because I thought maybe being scared is like natural.

And it’s because I’m making a mistake. You know? I wrestled with it. I wasn’t just like, “This is cool. I’m doing it.”. I’m, like, “I have all the information.”. I had, none of the information and I was terrified. And it doesn’t mean that it’s a sign that you shouldn’t do it.

Debbie:

Yeah and thinking about that conversation, it’s so interesting where you are now, and it could have gone either way, right?

That person could have been right. But you were only 23! You were so young, you could have, have gone back and worked for another corporation. I’m pretty sure.

Maybe even your old job would’ve taken you back, especially if you left in good terms. But I also think about those moments when somebody talks to you about that, especially when somebody older, obviously they know a lot more than us, but a lot of the things that they know is their own experiences.

And I think about them and what happened, right? Did they take the risk and something happened or did they just stay where they were and didn’t do anything and just thought about everything that could have gone wrong. And then they’re trying to stop you from doing something that could change your life. You know?

So, it’s so interesting when people give you advice. I always try to take it like a, you know, they say like a grain of salt because everybody’s experiences are so different, but I think taking risk and going out of your comfort zone, even if it doesn’t turn out the way you want it, eventually it’ll lead to something that you never knew could even happen, because sometimes what we want doesn’t necessarily come into fruition. But the universe somehow gives us something that we didn’t know, we even needed.

Kayla:

Oh, you’re so right. And travel has such a way of doing that. Like, you make all the plans and then things go totally sideways from what you expected. And people take tons of risks, but they don’t see them as risks.

So, these conversations with like warnings and, “Oh, I think you’re gonna regret that.”. Like, now I’m so used to these conversations and I always ask people, did you go to college? Okay. Talk about risk, spending four years spending tons of money, doing something with no guarantees.

So, that’s like the no guarantees. And I also ask people, “Do you have kids? Because you didn’t know how to do that. You didn’t know how to do a lot of it. I’m sure.”.

And even if you were like a professional nanny, you were not prepared to be a parent, but you did it and you got through it. And if you took the risk of going to college and you have kids, frankly, that’s like, you’re like an adrenaline junkie already and you don’t know it.

Debbie:

I love that. I actually love those two analogies because that’s right.

Now, going to college, I mean, back then it was so much more cheaper. Now, it’s like taking out a loan for a house, you know, and its so much, and then most people, I think at least the people that I know, I don’t know the rest of the world, but a lot of the people that I know didn’t even continue with what they graduated with.

I certainly didn’t. And you know, it is, it’s a huge risk to do that and children, oh my goodness, yeah. Taking care of another human life that, oh my gosh, that’s crazy. That is a risk. Right!

And being like, “oh my gosh, am I gonna bring up a human being into the world that’s actually gonna be like a good human being and productive or am I gonna like bring up a serial killer?”.

I don’t know, like what bigger risk is there than that?

Kayla:

Truly, like having a failed adventure or a failed business and then going back and getting a job, that’s peanuts compared to reproduction.

Debbie:

Yeah. Absolutely. I’m like, “Yep. That’s a risk.”.

And I don’t think a lot of people think about that. I don’t think that because it’s traditional, right? And I don’t think, honestly, I think all of that, like you had mentioned, Kayla, is a huge risk, but I think it’s, so it’s something that is expected that we don’t see it as a risk until like, you know, we really have to think about it as you get older.

But yeah, that, I love that. That’s a really great point.

So, now that you are able to do this, you have been doing this for quite some time now, so, around what? Like five years this year?

Kayla:

Yeah, yeah. Yes it is.

Debbie:

That you’ve been a digital nomad, how did you actually find your remote work? Because in 2017, like you had mentioned, even though it was known, it wasn’t super popular yet the pandemic didn’t happen yet.

And there’s not as many companies that were offering remote work. Obviously, it’s not the same as it was like 10 years ago and there was barely anything, but it still wasn’t the absolute norm.

How did you go out and find that remote job that could help you sustain a lifestyle that you have?

Kayla:

Yeah, it was definitely not the same. You are so right about that. And I found my initial work on Craigslist actually.

So, this is kind of a secret, like a hot, like a pro tip. I think, I don’t know, maybe it’s not pro, but it’s a little bit of a hidden gem for finding remote work is going on Craigslist and going to their gigs section and people post gig work.

Like, I need a writer to write an article a week. There’s like a weird amount of remote work opportunities.

And back in 2017, the job boards were not nearly as robust. So, you kind of had to like shuffle around and look on Facebook, Facebook groups.

I found a lot of work through there. So, it was not a formal, it wasn’t like getting a contract with, you know, like getting a remote contract with Amazon or something it was much more piece together.

But I took a kind of non, maybe nothing’s maybe once you’re on the offbeat road, nothing’s unconventional, but, I didn’t get like a full income with my remote work right away.

So, I do what I like is called like, deflating your lifestyle. Like, a lot of people move to cheaper countries and go traveling somewhere cheap to make their money go farther. But I also didn’t pay for hostels in the beginning.

I volunteered with, through work away where like a hostel would need someone to like do laundry once a day or something. And then they let you stay for free.

So, I spent as little money as I could possibly do while making money. I had money coming in, so I had some money coming in, but it wasn’t like a super like cookie cutter, you know, like, “I’ll leave my job. I have a new salary that pays for everything.”. It was a little like, you know, sticks and glue and all held together delicately.

Debbie:

And that’s the thing, right? I think if you really want it, you will do whatever it takes to get it because it always frustrates me when I hear people, “Hey, I wanna do what you do. I wanna do something similar.”, and it’s all talk and there’s no action behind it.

And you are the living proof, Kayla, that you can do something about it and make this sustainable if you actually go out there and do something about it. And it’s not easy, especially for you five years ago, it’s so much more easier now.

Oh my gosh, I look at job boards all the time because we list out like remote work for people for our website. And there’s just so many opportunities out there.

You know, you don’t have to scrounge around and look for how you did it, Kayla, because there’s just so much more opportunities now.

And it’s, I love it. I love when people do what you do, Kayla, because it really is a testament to how creative you can be, how you can make things work, if you really just go out there and do something.

Kayla:

Yes. And I think people who talk, but don’t act, think that they can’t do anything right now.

Like, they’re not ready to quit their job, today. They’re not ready. Like, even if they found their dream job and it’s remote and they got it today, they wouldn’t be ready to quit their normal job.

So, they feel frozen because they think that they have to wait to act. And I think that once you start making changes and really preparing you realize that there’s a ton that you can do right now, like start deflating your lifestyle cost right now.

Like, go through how many monthly payments, if you wanna go travel, not everybody’s on a strict budget, but let’s assume that if you’re a beginner, you are on a strict budget. So, go through all of your monthly payments and cut, like slash and burn as much as you can and start to learn how to cook.

That’s such a life skill. Whenever you’re traveling, if there’s a, like a hostel with a kitchen and you save so much money by like learning how to, I actually just had my hostel breakfast this morning and I felt like, so it felt so like cozy it’s scrambled eggs and refried beans.

I had it for breakfast. I used to have it every single day while I was in hostels. I literally like cans of beans with like my name written all over them. And these little things that you can do today and working on your digital skills because whatever your job is, it’s gonna be digital.

So, start upskilling like, today. Go take a free SEO training from HubSpot or go take, if you wanna learn how to code, there’s like an entire free coding.

I’ll get you the link afterwards, an entire free like coding institute. You can learn how to code starting today for free. You can do so much today. You don’t have to wait until something else is in place.

Debbie:

Yeah, absolutely. And, and the thing is you’ll always find an excuse why you shouldn’t do something. And you had mentioned Kayla, even when you find a remote work, maybe you’ll find an excuse, why you shouldn’t go and become a digital nomad or at least travel for, for a bit of time, because you’re always gonna find something, right? And obviously there’s a lot of things out there that can deter you, you know, illnesses or things that happen with, with your family or if there’s just a lot of things.

But for the most part, I think most people will just find excuses because I think that’s how our mind works, is it always wants us to, to stay in our comfort zone because it’s trying to protect us. But, you also have to think about, “Okay, is this really what’s best for me? Or is this something that my mind is just telling me to do because it wants me to stay in my comfort zone?”.

And I think you kind of have to decipher between the two. “Is it really gonna keep me safe? Or is this just something that I’m doing to, you know, to not do something that’s, that’s a risk for me”. And you know, you talk about deflating a lifestyle and you did that, Kayla, and I love that because I think most people don’t realize how much better you can live when you’re not.

And a lot of the metropolitan areas and city areas in the United States like, oh my gosh, it’s so much cheaper in so many parts of the world. And you could live like Kings and Queens over there with how much you earn, even though it’s not as much as you’re earning maybe right now.

Kayla:

Yeah. A lot of people have this like image or, you know, in their mind they think I am like, I’m broke.

You know, like I don’t have enough money to do what I want, but if you can like remove yourself from your current situation and if you work online and you’re really broke living in New York City, you will not be really broke working online from Vietnam, which has the lowest cost of living in the world.

And is everybody, you know, everybody love, raves about how amazing it is to stay there. You can do, yeah, the opportunities are really like, honestly endless, but you have to get over this hurdle of feeling like things are unachievable, like so many people just assume that things are unachievable for them.

And that is like a mindset switch that you have to turn off.

Debbie:

Yeah, absolutely. And you know, it is a lot of mindset and, you know, telling yourself, you can’t do things. “You’re too broke. You’re too this, you’re too that.”.

And then if you just sit down, really think about things, you can make a plan out of it, you know, I’m, you know, I’m not saying that you should just go out there and just start doing whatever.

But if you do make a plan, I mean, it took you months, right, Kayla? To just plan things out, make sure you got what you need and then that’s it.

But also, I think too, like I say this too. I think there’s people that over plan. And then all of a sudden it’s like years and you still haven’t done anything.

So, you should definitely have a deadline too, because I’m, we’re telling you, it’s like, yeah, I have a plan. And you’re like, “Yeah, I did my plan.”. But you know, I’m still doing it. It’s like five years later, you’re still planning.

Kayla:

I think that people should give themselves six months. If you honestly feel like you are going to regret it. If you don’t try and you are able and you have to go for it.

I know there’s some people who have circumstances that are, you know, temporary, maybe somebody’s ill or they’re ill. And there’s a lot of things. But if you feel like you could, like, if you could just get on a plane and leave in a month, you don’t have a house.

Or, you know, there are all these, like, you don’t have all these attachments, then you could go, you know, you could, you just have to figure out what’s holding you back. And how do you amend, like, you know, tidy up those things.

Debbie:

Yeah, absolutely. And again, it’s just, I think the biggest obstacle is yourself. It’s just what you’re telling yourself.

I was talking to my husband about this and I think a few of my friends, it, you know, we live a part of the year in New York city and it’s very expensive here. And every time, like, you’re always saying, “I’m broke, I’m broke”.

I can’t go anywhere because everything is so expensive. And I always say like, “Switch up your mind and say like money is abundant”, and I could make it like, it’s easy to make money because it just comes whenever I need it.

And then things just starts to happen. I think when you put yourself in that type of mindset where things are scarce, then that’s what happens in your life. But when you think very abundantly and obviously don’t be delusional, that’s not, that’s not what I’m saying, but it’s just prepping yourself because there are so many opportunities out there.

And if you’re just saying to yourself, “Nothing is out there”, then nothing is gonna come because you’re probably overlooking things too, that are right in front of you.

So, yeah, definitely it’s, a lot of it is mindset. And also like, because this happens, happened to me too. I don’t know if it happens to you too, Kayla.

It’s like, you, you wanna do something and then you stop yourself and then it’s like, you keep planning and then nothing happens. And then you regret it and then you see other people do it. And you’re like, “Oh my gosh, I could have been that person”. And then it makes you depressed.

Kayla:

Yeah. And other people doing what you want to do, shouldn’t make, cause sometimes it does make you feel bad if you thought about it and didn’t act. But whenever you see people doing what you wanna do, you should see that as proof. And that’s your sign.

It’s not, you know, and that’s the scarcity thing. I think sometimes see people like, if people wanna start a blog or start, you know, drop shipping or any of these businesses and they think there are too many, like you see a successful blog and you think, “oh, it’s like, that means that there’s like less for the rest of us because every successful blog means that there’s a smaller slice of the pie”.

And that is not how it works. Like the laws of physics do not apply that way to remote work. There’s endless remote work opportunities. If you wanna start a brand, brands quit every day, every day there’s an influencer who puts it away and is done.

There’s a blog that stops publishing. And you know what, even if they didn’t, there’s always enough because we’re, people are online all the time consuming. There’s never, opportunity is never running dry. It’s only increasing in capacity.

Debbie:

Yeah. It only runs dry if you actually stop doing what you’re doing.

In terms of that, I think a lot of people do tend to stop because they don’t get the right results or the results that they want right away. And I see this all the time.

You have, you know, like the shiny object syndrome, and then you, you know, you mention Kayla, it’s like, you see all these people doing really well, especially on social because we mostly just put out things that are super positive.

Like, what we’re going through that are, that are really great. But I know this has been said before, but it’s still so true. Like, you don’t know, what’s really going on behind closed doors until you are there. And it takes a long time to succeed in something and you have to be really dedicated and you have to be persistent.

And I think most people quit, you know, at a time when they should be going, right? And they should be learning from their mistakes. And then learning instead of quitting, you have to learn how to pivot.

And that’s so important with this because especially if you’re doing something that not many people are doing, or even if people are doing it, their way of doing is gonna be different than yours. And it may be not working for you.

So, you have to learn on your own. And I think that if you wanna do something or if you’re on entrepreneur, the first thing that you have to realize is, are you willing to do things that are out of your comfort zone?

And second, are you willing to problem solve? Because if you are not a problem solver or at least, you know, you don’t like failing, then it’s definitely not for you.

And there’s nothing wrong with sticking to a nine to five. That could be a remote job too.

Kayla:

Yeah. And there’s no shame in that.

Sometimes, if you get a bunch of digital nomads together or remote work, people there starts to become this. Like, I don’t know, popular.

Like, there’s like an attitude that if you work at a job that’s remote, it’s not as good as having your own business and you’re not as hardcore. And that’s all really made up and it doesn’t matter. None of it matters. All that matters is that you’re able to do what you want do.

So, if you feel like you need to, you wanna start your own business, you should or just work, have a normal job online. You should. And I would also add, you said about not quitting, and just problem solving and pivoting. I would also add, if you are gonna start your own thing, you should be committed to it for two years with no returns.

And I don’t know, I made up that number, but that’s the number that I always tell people, because if you’re not willing to invest, like people say, like I have a blog. So, I talk to, sometimes people talk to me who are aspiring bloggers. And they say, “I would like kill to be a blogger.”.

And I ask them like, “Oh, well, where’s your, like, what’s your blog? Because if you wanna be a blogger, all you have to do is buy your domain and start writing”. And then it’s, “Oh, well I would kill to be a pro you know, to make money blogging”, but you’re not gonna get to make a money if you don’t get to starting.

And if you think I am, I will do anything for six months, you know? And then at that point it’s like a failure. If it hasn’t worked, you should be committed to like two years. If not more before you expect to take a payday, because if you are, you know, I just not, because it will take that long for everyone, but because going into it with this like cash register mindset that anyone can just make it happen right away. I think you’re gonna get discouraged and quit.

Debbie:

I absolutely agree with you on that one. I think they even have a study that they said that businesses start actually picking up or actually making some money at the fifth year. So, it takes a long time.

It takes a lot of dedication and it, you know, you don’t make any money in the beginning. And I think the only people that make money maybe right away are people who have done businesses already and they know what they’re doing.

So, I think that’s food for thought there. If you, if you do know somebody who’s like, “oh yeah, you know, I made money the first six months and then it was sustainable and blah, blah, blah”. And like ask them what they did before that , did they fail a lot of other businesses? Like, did they have a partner who knows what they’re doing already? Because most of the time that’s a fluke. That’s not, that’s not the norm. Right? So yeah, it definitely takes a lot of time.

Kayla:

That is the most, one of the most important things that anyone who wants to start something online should hear, because you hit the nail on the head. What were you doing before this and your partner?

It’s such, it’s such a sneaky thing. Like, people will say, “I started a blog and in six months I was able to live off of it full time”. And then if you ask them, what were you doing before this? They’ll say, “oh, I was a web designer”.

Well, you were like building houses. And then you were able to build your own house. But, if you had never built a house before, it would take you a very long time to build a livable house. And that’s the context that’s really missing.

And I know, I see it a lot in like short form content, especially like on TikTok. People are like, I did this in two months and now I make 10,000 a month in my sleep.

And maybe that’s like a whole separate anecdote about how TikTok is like, like, you know, so much FOMO and so little information. But yeah, you just, don’t assume, I think it’s, you should always assume that people already knew how to do these things. If those stories are true.

Debbie:

Yeah. And also I do wanna talk about this and I’ll probably even talk about this during like another episode, people say all the time, “I wanna make $10,000 a month”, right? And then you see all of these influencers, other business people saying they make a thousand, “oh $10,000 a month”.

So, it’s actually, you have to really realize, yes, they may be taking in, in their business $10,000 a month, but what are they pocketing? So, that’s, it’s really important to acknowledge that because my business just started to go, like, you know, we started making a lot of income this year and it actually, you don’t pocket that $10,000 a month, everybody.

It takes way beyond that. And it was something that I was talking about with my husband. I’m like, “wow, the $10,000, like, you need to at least make multiple six figures to hit 10,000 a month”. And it, it’s not like you make a hundred thousand and then you pocket that, no, like your taxes takes like almost ridiculous, like 30 or 40% of it.

And then if you’re paying for people, you know, and then the services, like it’s actually not $10,000 everybody. So, that’s just like a, a number that a lot of people will give you, but it’s not realistic. So, just keep that in mind as well.

Kayla:

It’s such a mirage. You’re so right. And especially if you’re living in other countries too, if you’re traveling and doing the expat thing, how much money you make literally changes with currency fluctuations.

Debbie:

Yeah.

Kayla:

Like, I live in Europe and I make US dollars and the Euro and the dollar, or just had a major shift and it was in my favor. So, I was happy. But a lot of my friends are the other way online.

The day that the Euro and the dollar broke even the Facebook groups for expats were hilarious. People were like popping champagne. And then other people were like, you know, I can’t believe I just converted everything and lost all this money.

And you honestly have no idea. Whenever you go abroad, you add a whole another, like, twist to it. And you honestly have no idea how much money you’re gonna take home.

You have to be very, I would say it’s like such a life skill. Whenever you are doing something alternative to just be as frugal as possible. Just that skill. You can’t take it to you almost can’t take it too.

Like, I’ve sewn up, sewn up holes in my underwear, and maybe I’ve taken it too far, but it’s gonna help you. It’s like coast so much longer during those tough times financially. And there will be tough times financially. It’s a part of the journey.

Debbie:

Yeah, absolutely. And there’s no shame in that.

Listen, I thrift everything like, and you know, it doesn’t matter if I’m making a million dollars a year or like a thousand dollars a year.

Also, the thing for me is that what’s more important, right? Is it the things that you’re buying or the lifestyle that you have in terms of like how you’re spending your days?

And for me, that’s so much more important than, than material things. And for some people, they love to have luxury in terms of what they have. And that’s good too.

So, then you kind of have to balance that out because like you had mentioned, Kayla, you’re going to have lean times. You’re not just gonna make all of this money all the time and not to say that, you know, that can’t happen. Absolutely. But there’s certain times in your life where you have to just be more conscious of what’s going in to your pocket.

So yeah, just, you know, just, just be prepared because you never know what life throws at you.

Kayla:

No, and it doesn’t mean that you’re failing or it’s going wrong. Like, I mean, it’s a bad feeling whenever money runs out.

And like, I can remember whenever I had just moved to the Netherlands and my bank card was rejected at checkout on like a $3 purchase. And I came home and cried and I could have interpreted that as like a sign that I was failing.

And I’m sure, I mean, it felt bad, but you just it just happens. It’s almost like, I don’t know, like offbeat life, bingo. It’s like, oh, you know, said something in a different language. And it went really badly.

And I, you know, I ordered the wrong thing and oh, I can’t afford, you know, it’s like, all these little things are such a normal part of the lifestyle, but they’re not like sexy Instagram reels material.

So, you might feel like it’s all going wrong for you, but it’s not. That’s just how it goes.

Debbie:

Absolutely. It’s part of the day to day things that most people either don’t think about, or they don’t share, because like you had mentioned Kayla, it’s, it’s not sexy. None of this stuff is sexy.

And it’s also, it’s things like, you know, things we don’t wanna be bothered about. Like, “oh my God, that’s so annoying and it’s boring. I don’t wanna do it”. I love that.

So, Kayla let’s move forward to about maybe 40 to 50 years from now. And you’re looking back in your life, what legacy would you like to leave? And what do you wanna be remembered for?

Kayla:

Wow, big question!

I think that a lot of what I would like to be remembered for is a lot of what we’ve been talking about. Just helping people realize that they are capable of a lot more than they think they are.

No one who achieves big things is better than you. They just went for it. And I would really love for the people, everyone I know to, you know, really think that of themselves.

Debbie:

Yeah. I love that. And it’s just a matter of, of doing and learning and failing and keep going.

Kayla:

Yeah, that’s literally it. That’s the whole equation.

Debbie:

Thank you so much, Kayla, for visiting us and for sharing with us, your journey, we really appreciate you. If our listeners wanna learn more about your work and they find you?

Kayla:

They can find me on my website, writingfromnowhere.com.

Debbie:

Perfect. Thanks Kayla!

Kayla:

Thank you, Debbie!


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Show Credits:

Audio Engineer: Ben Smith

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